Warhammer Dark Omen Forum

First tournament this year.

Date: 30th January 2010 (5pm GMT+0) (Deutsch: 18 Uhr)
Register Deadline: 26th January 2010  (Night to 27)
Confirmation Deadline: 28th January 2010 (Night to 29)

Ruleset: New Balance Mod 7k (http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/new-balance-revamped-t658.15.html)

Players (14/19)

• Darkmancer confirmed
  
• warhammerfreak confirmed
  
• Flak
• Alavet confirmed
  
• Ceyl
• Wkurwiony  confirmed 1
  
• Cirroz
• lordbraprus confirmed
  
• Jeronimo  confirmed 3
  
• Shaco2
• Abe
• Nitrox
• olly confirmed
  
• Gustl86
• Kura confirmed
  
• Satyrgo confirmed
  
• Raditz confirmed
  
• Ghabry confirmed 2
  
• Mr Shadow confirmed
  
• ContraSnake confirmed
  
• Jim confirmed
  
  Votings:
  
  Fair Omen is not available this month because it has been played in December.
  Possible Rulesets: 3k/10, 5k/15, 9k/30, Dost5, Factions, New balance 7k, CDO, Darkmancer one (see his post)
  
  Ruleset:
  
  • New Balance Mod: 7 (wkurwiony, Cirroz, Jeronimo, olly, Kura, warhammerfreak, Ghabry, Mr Shadow)
  • CDO: 5 (lordbraprus, Alavet, Gustl86, Satyrgo, raditz, Flak)
  • 5k/15: 1 (Ceyl)
  • Darkmancer ruleset: 1 (Darkmancer)

Fixture

---

Qualification

4 Player Groups: 2 Fights per Enemy
3 Player Groups: 3 Fights per Enemy


The best two of each group enter the semi final!

---

Semi Final (Elimination)

Games: Best of Three, Winner enters Final

---

Final

---

Results

Congratulation warhammerfreak

Flaks Magic Egg Dance
january (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xwf-KwVbz_w#normal)

Videos by wkurwiony
Dark Omen January Tournament - vs Warhammerfreak (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHTxFcqdlr8#normal)

Dark Omen January (2010) Tournament vs Warhammerfreak 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTHKbBEOFEo#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Warhammerfreak 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMPgBbODbKM#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTRso8PGqv0#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 2 part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHx483pGvrc#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 2 part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOFgozLL2kQ#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ycrg-t6mio#normal)

Videos by Ghabry

Qualification:

wkurwiony:
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. wkurwiony (1) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hT7wQTb-pEI#normal)

Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. wkurwiony (2) - Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iesrzqMs7U#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. wkurwiony (2) - Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJELAnzLNf4#normal)

Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. wkurwiony (3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7mBhrs_npyA#normal)

warhammerfreak:
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. warhammerfreak (1) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0uNbfImtAk#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. warhammerfreak (2) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeVSuQ-X6vc#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Qualification vs. warhammerfreak (3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQJsoGC0u0g#normal)

Semi Final:

Itlerion:
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Semi Final vs. Itlerion (1) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JUgSQ8qFB0#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Semi Final vs. Itlerion (2) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RWHHS3ZWkM#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Semi Final vs. Itlerion (3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLj5R3A2_ik#normal)

Final:

Darkmancer:
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Final vs. Darkmancer (1) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0YDXvhem34#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Final vs. Darkmancer (2) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPs17ln_2_w#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Final vs. Darkmancer (3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93Lj9Un0Emc#normal)

warhammerfreak:
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Final vs. warhammerfreak (1) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFFi24VaUM8#normal)
Dark Omen (Jan 2010) Final vs. warhammerfreak (2) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsPR6UuJ0kM#normal)

I'd like to sign up for the tornament please.


I'd like to suggest a possible ruleset too.

7K
Empire & Undead may only have 1 of any unit type.
Green skin may only have 2 of any unit tpe.

Exception, undead may have any number of zombies.

Items allowed Grudebringer Sword, the book of spells.  The greenskins may have morks war banner.

No unit with a movement speed greater than 4 may pick up or equipe any item.

* 4 is the moving speed of foot troops, units with fast movement are ogres, elves, vampire, & cavalry.

Players choose 2 races and create a 7k army for each.

Each player fights every over player 4 times. Once hosting with each army, once connecting with each army.

Each player must use a different race to fight the other.

Disconnects count as a draw unless both players agree the winner was obvious.

Any games unable to take place due to failing to host/connect count as a draw. *

2 Maps are chosen by mutual consent, each must be hosted and connected to by each party.*

Each player receives 2 points for a winning a round of 4 games, 1 point for a draw.

yeah you missed one, new balance 7k ^^

I would like to join, I vote good old 5/15.

Darkmancer and warhammerfreak are in

and Flak is in, i could agree with WHF on 5k-15

Unexpected surprise. Since when?









Happy new year Gabriel.

pretty sure its like for quite some time, in december you couldnt pick 3k/10
oh and im in and i vote for that mod of mine if its possible :P c'mon whose with me ? hehe

btw Ghabry colors of nicks didnt changed since november i think :P bembe was changing them ?

Count me in, I vote for 5k / 15 :)

9/30, im in

This is normal since we vote for rulesets. Last used ruleset is forbidden in next month.


Done. sorry. Had forgotten this.

Ceyl, Alavet, Wkurwiony: You are in

Count me in. Want to try New Balance Mod. I hope wkurwiony finished his work with black orcs :)

oh yeah another vote ;] btw cirroz on what channel you are sitting on ? cant find you on hamachi

as for black orcs well they are complete and kick ass ;] they got almost same stats like bigguns only with leadership 8, based on 4th edition book, and are unbreakable ;]

My User name is Jeronimo, and I will take part of this Tournament.
Vote goes for... chan chan chan: Wkurwiony 7k/Mod


I joined his network and played like 4 hours in order to test the System. Its very nice indeed.

We had a lot of fun and recorded videos. My question is... What are you waiting for?

and me too. i vote wkurwiony mod because its hard to pronounce :o :)

Count me in aswell pls...i do not mind which ruleset is chosen

YO! COUNT ME IN! I AM READY!  :-X Eh.. Maybe soon I hope.. Glad to find you guyz!  :-\ My name is Abe . Fun time check! Jan 30 right?

Im in as long as Sigmar is willing to let me.

Hello Abe ;)

Yes, we play 30th January, you must choose a ruleset (there are many to choose, as is written at first page).
Take a look at them before choosing.

Some are explained at WIKI pages, others by posts (example: rules & settings topic).

i want to present my ruleset... and if it is posible mi vote go to it..

to see what it brings go here http://forum.dark-omen.org/sprites/adding-units-to-orc-for-multiplayer-mod-t652.0.html;msg6243#msg6243 (http://forum.dark-omen.org/sprites/adding-units-to-orc-for-multiplayer-mod-t652.0.html;msg6243#msg6243)

CDO Charactical Dark Omen is the name of ruleset! 7K gold

i change my vote for CDO Charactical Dark Omen - 7K gold

love you :$

Shaco2 and Abe are in.

CDO Ruleset accepted for voting.

and if you want to find informations about New Balance its here :
http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/new-balance-revamped-t658.0.html;msg6274;topicseen#msg6274 (http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/new-balance-revamped-t658.0.html;msg6274;topicseen#msg6274)

Sign me in, for me ruleset doesnt matter

I will be in this Month's Tournament and would like to try Wkurwiony's Ruelset this time and will probably Vote for CDO next time.


:)









(http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/9199/sothr.jpg) (http://img63.imageshack.us/i/sothr.jpg/)

oh olly but i will star university in febrary.. this is my last TT in a couple of month  :( cant you vote for me now, and next TT you vote wkuiorny ? snif snif

hi,
i am new here, i want to play the tournament , i vote for CDO

Hi trere I want to play in tournament as well. I vote for new balance mod of Wkurwiony becouse most players vote for it.

what?? he has 4 votes and i have 3 votes, it havent been actualized the vote counts, have you ever seen what the mods brings? wich units they bring... think for a while

you should enter the mods topic and read what htey are about.. h

here is mine, i added snotlings , snotling wagonet and the orc heroe grimor, to orcs, and put blood dragon unit to undead..

http://forum.dark-omen.org/sprites/adding-units-to-orc-for-multiplayer-mod-t652.0.html;msg6243#msg6243 (http://forum.dark-omen.org/sprites/adding-units-to-orc-for-multiplayer-mod-t652.0.html;msg6243#msg6243)

and here is the other, that wich you said it had 1 more vote, because i presented my ruleset later, that is the reason it has more votes.

http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/new-balance-revamped-t658.0.html (http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/new-balance-revamped-t658.0.html)


and here videos using my mod

http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/i-present-my-multiplayer-mod-cdo-t656.0.html;msg6325#msg6325 (http://forum.dark-omen.org/rules-and-standards/i-present-my-multiplayer-mod-cdo-t656.0.html;msg6325#msg6325)

Stop telling everybody how "great" your Ruleset is.

Don't influence everybody in his Voting Decision...


(And I added all new signed in players to the player list)

i told him to see mine, and wkuwyorni mod, not just vote it because have more votes... . so some one that have a mod and need votes, he has no chance because the other mod has 1 more vote?... this made me think that like in a voting situation votes should be secret, sending a pm to the admin sayin what vote you do.. so, the "more votes " influence does not exist :D. is that a bad idea?? because if iam trying to influence, is because i ahve to fihgt against the public votes.. that influence in ppl desicion.

Sorry I didn't read this before but Excellent Ruleset, I will certainly vote for this sometime as very close to how I used to play many Years ago before we developed a Point System Ruleset. Your ruleset is very easy for any new members to get to grips with and the concept of playing multiple times could be used to take turns in playing Defensively with a Defensive army perhaps ( to eliminate opponent sitting on their Hill with archers and Arty and expecting us to march slowly upto them, as if they were playing Single player mode with AI).

:)

Just to say I played with Kura many games, dont know how many hours would that be but a lot so he knows this mod. Btw he's pretty good i must say ^^ so watch out guys hehe

i actually liek Darkmancer idea but love to play new mods!
as for Darkmancer proposal, i like general ideas (especially item restriction for MS=5) but dont like:
4 battles vs one opponent (too logn time to play)
disconenct=draw (:-()
1 unit of each type = less flexibility =gold loss like 280 or 350 gc left which u cant use?
npt balanced armies/items = original gold doesnt counts some factors, esp. for items.

and finally, noone will choose orcs :D.

ich liebe dich ghabry

@avavet & olly

Yes, i tried to make the rules as simple as possible, although trying to make people use 2 sides was a mistake - 4 games are too much.

If you have more than 200 gold left, it's highly likely there's a better unit combo, chalk it up to an advantage for the greenskins (spid's & scorps 4tw)

Actually orc's arn't too bad, you will be able to field a full roster, of mostly top tier units + all the items.  The other sides will typically field 2/3ish top units then are forced into standard units.  I made a mistake of not allowing boarriders to use morks banner thou.

I think the max 1 unit of each type forces more flexibility, certainly a wider range of units will be fielded than usual, and it has a nice balancing effect (empire arty 1 motar, 1 cannon max, 1 flagellant, 1 bgk, etc).

Fairly inmaterial as the new mods are understandably more interest.

hi , i will play this Tourny, now i will use another pc, so i hope it has no connections problems. i vote my friend CDO mod

Satyrgo plz double check if its working, as i dont want to wait that much again ;]

i will play with my friend in his father studio, it has 3 pc with internet :D

hi... i am practicing with ramiro a lot.. he explained me a lot about multiplayer stuff,  i want to play this TT and my vote goes to CDO, ramiros mod XD

lol

yep, i went to an argentinian wargames forum (WHF and W40K) asking if someone knows the old WHF pc game dark omen :$. and there are something like 6 ppl who said they do :O

How many people were at the wargames forum? I hope only 6 + you ;).

And Satyrgo: Make sure that you have a someone that translates the texts for you because in the last tournament we had a communication problem...

I update the player/vote list this night

ok bit later ;)

Update done. I hope that I havnt missed someone. Already 18 players :O

How many people were at the wargames forum? I hope only 6 + you ;).
[/quote]

lol, does the posts have similar ip adress?

Ghabry two things ;]

my ruleset got 5 votes
and who is "satyrgo friend" ?

and we can all make :O when 18 players will confirm hehe ;] would it be the biggest number? dont know about previous tournaments too much ;]

Yes, they have both the same IP, is this a problem?

Wkur: Votes fixed. Satyrgo wrote in his post that he plays together with a friend somewhere (but with more then 1 PC of course ;)).
Yes 18 is a record, dunno the old one...

And again so you don't miss it:
And Satyrgo: Make sure that you have a someone that translates the texts for you because in the last tournament we had a communication problem...

not all argentinians go to english particular lesson during 7 years, or just not all know englsh enaugh to comunicate in a internacional forum. so yes, i posted in my friend sabes place, anyway in hamachi it is me and him connected in diferent pc ;) i hope you are not thinking iam a members chiter ahahhahahahahah

ohhh and here you have mi post

http://www.wargamez.com.ar/foro/juegos/alguien-conoce-el-juego-de-pc-de-whf-dark-omen-11071.html (http://www.wargamez.com.ar/foro/juegos/alguien-conoce-el-juego-de-pc-de-whf-dark-omen-11071.html)

i put game videos :D, and look that the last reply says "Juegazoooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

is like saying: great gameeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

even the admin "PAC" said he played it in his old win98 pc

wkuwirny, iam satyrgos friend, i live with him in the same city.

and a 18 player list :O:O but i think we will be something like 15 o14 , that is a lot any ways

lordbraprus i meant that on the list there is "satyrgo friend", and i dont think it reffers to you ;] and i know you guys are friends ;]

btw does my nick is really that hard to type ? hehe

hope it will be great tourney no matter the ruleset :)

ahhh gharby mis undertand, satyrgo refered to me, we both will play in my father studio :D , so one player less. fix that please

Ohhhh. Ok. I remove Satyrgos Friend because it's a duplicate ;)

When 5k/15 wouldn't make it I will change my vote to Wkurwionys system.

ok since 5k is out i think ill vote CDO instead

I sign in, too.

I vote for New Balance

14 hours left to sign in then confirmation starts!

Anybody that isnt already signed in and wants to play: Sign in NOW or wait until last week of February.

id like to have all signed in and confirmed so that i can film the Egg Shuffle on Friday evening plz

i confirm...

confirm :)

confirm

Jeronimo confirms.

Confirmed!

'Ere We Go!                                                      


Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!


:)




Kill 'Em All!

(http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/747/65122275.jpg) (http://img715.imageshack.us/i/65122275.jpg/)(http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/8416/ingamebox3d.jpg) (http://img714.imageshack.us/i/ingamebox3d.jpg/)

Cooooooooooooooooooooooooooonfiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiirmeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed The Commander Nitroxowy! :D

Confirmed.

The confirmation ends in the night from 28 to 29. So you will have time on Friday ^^

3 hours left for sign in ^^. And so many confirmations already :O

confirm

Well, it seems that I missed the deadline with an hour, hope you can accept anyway  :o
It's the late Ju-Jutsu training's fault really, so it was out of my hands...Hehehehe

So, I take my chances; I would like to sign up!

And I vote for New Balance Mod, and can confirm at the same time.

Regards
Mr Shadow

confirm ^^

Mr. Shadow: You are in

Voting is over.
The tournament ruleset will be the New Balance Mod

Confirmmm

ok i see that NewBalance ruleset won the voting ;] thanks for votes and i hope it will be great tourney

as for files, i cant upload them here so i will send PM to everybody that cofirms, or you can join hamachi channel that is in my signature and you will have link in welcome message over there

cheers

ok end of confirmation, we are 13 players (out of 18 -.-)

What group sizes? 3 : 3 : 3 : 4?

i wonder why allways there are "ghost" voting members..

not-confirmed, i am having to work in my weekend off  >:(

but i will still make the Egg Shuffle tomorrow

Oh btw: my fault, the confirmation is not over!
You have 3 hours left... sorry for that

I would like to join and compete please. i am new to online multiplayer games, so dont expect much from me. this should be fun.

btw jim said he wants to participate if its not to late in other thread

I'm assuming we're using:

NB-Darkomen Hamachi Channel
New Balance Patch + Map Pack
7k Gold Armies

Is this all correct?

you get this patch from that channel, or in PM i sent link to everybody that confirmed, if someone dont have it tell me
and tourney will be on regular tourney channel

as for gold yes 7k and New Balance patch + map pack

Confirmation time is over!

Result is: 14 players. 5 : 5 : 4 ?

14 players

Ghabry/Wkurwiony: I suggest 4-4-3-3 since is easier to advance and better organized.

Groups of 4 players: 2 battles agaisnt each other (2x3= 6 total).
Groups of 3 players: 3 battles against each other (3x2= 6 total).

First groups stage will take normal time (calculation), then things go faster with 4º & 2º.

With 5-5-4 players wont fight each other inside each group, there will be option to select a convenient oponnent, thats why im against 5 players large group.
Then Finals as a group of 3 players is quite long (a necessary evil from 9 to 12 players).

ok if you like group/double elimination format more than what we had last month than so be it ;] and i guess it will be quicker

Flak if you will be doing egg shuffle make it for groups 4 : 4 : 3 : 3 and lets hope you can somehow join us tommorow ;]

I don't think I will be able to show up tomorrow, I am sorry : x. Please take me out of the list.
Still I want to wish you all gl and hf, hope you enjoy the Tourny. I am looking forward to participate in the next one again :).

Oh and another thing... please don't send me mails, trying to convince me of any system. It won't work, I have my opinion.

Back after popular demand The Egg Shuffle

january (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xwf-KwVbz_w#normal)

Well I missed my confirnmation deadline, but I still want to play. Is it possible to pass my delayed confirnmation anyway?

I dont have any problem. I agree with Kura appearence, since is your first tournament.

Nothing can be worse than September of last year, where we updated players at last minute considering some abandon and others appear to play without having confirmed too.

At least, you Kura appeared the night before :)

Sorry. I have to follow the rules.

So no confirmations ater the deadline.

If I violate the rules one time other users can argue in the next tournaments when they are in the same situation with "But in the last tournament you allowed it".

But because there are 14 player signed in there is very high chance that somebody has connection problems or doesn't appear at all... Then you could fill such a gap.


Edit:
Fixture is online

olly alavet darkmancer , i will do my best to die fast :P no joke, i will defeat olly and alavet muahahahaha.

Hey, give parctice into tourny for Kura. My mom told me hour ago, that we go today to a birthday to my Uncle :/

Ok
Kura: You can play for Nitrox

Tournament starts in 4 hours, don't forget join the Chat (http://chat.dark-omen.org)

Sorry, where can i find this channel? is it in hamachi NB-DarkOmen?

Ok tournament is over but there is no winner at the moment.

Whfreak and Darkmancer: Please discuss a time and make a draw battle :)
Best would be if you can find a time this sunday to do one quick battle.

edit:
Raditz, Jim: Give me a reason why you havn't took part in the tournament! You were confirmed!
Kura is an exception. Maybe you havn't read the other posts after I said no.

Videos by wkurwiony (http://forum.dark-omen.org/tournaments/tournament-january-2010-t649.0.html;msg6203#msg6203)

my games, cant upload one with ghabry as it is 11 minutes long ;/

How about cutting out some parts?
Youtube length limit is 10min 59sec.
Just remove some parts of the deployment part (or if it is too large split it in two parts)
The axebite pass video is around 14minutes. So you should split it in 2 parts. There are two buttons in avidemux one has a A and one a B on it. This is for defining boundaries.
1. Play the video until you find a good place where you want to cut.
2. Write down the framenumber
3. click A, enter the number of the last frame of the video (end of video) in the framecounter and press enter.
4. click B
5. press delete
Now you have the first half of the vid, encode it or if it is already encoded: COPY
6. Reload the original video
7. Go to Frame 0 (start) and click A
8. Enter the written down number in the frame counter and press enter
9. Press delete
10. Encode the 2nd part
11. Upload the 2 parts on youtube


Edit:
Why is there no mouse cursor on your videos?

Thanks for yet another great tournament!

But how come the finals wasn't completed?
Were the finalists too tired, or technical problems?


Regards.
Mr Shadow

They both ended up with the same amount of points, so have to play a rematch decisive game.

:)

Then we can start to congratulate Wkurwiony on creating a great Ruleset, once the Winner has been decided.

I was done with my last battles against at 1:00AM. warhammerfreak had no battles anymore so he went offline a while ago. But Darkmancer was able to defeat me often enough to get the same points whfreak has.

So they have to fight a draw match...

ATM he's online at hamachi but isn't responding:(.

Warhammerfreak won the last battle and is the winner of the torny.

I did have a lot of luck with some lobber shots and my army was stronger then yours in this map vs your army.

yerr i gave up before deployment really, i could have camped my corner to force you out a bit more, but i cba.

Well done anyway.

Ok thx for finishing this.
I update the results...

This is the official end of the tournament
Feel free now to critizise (in positive and negative way) the ruleset :)

Is a pity that last battle was already decided before playing it...

I rememeber Darkamncer Greenskin army had 3 big'un 3 immurtalz, 3 arrer boyz, 1 shaman.

Nice army indeed, but in disadvante against any artillery (specially lobber/mortar). Even more in a large map.

What map did u fight, I bet was Troll Land.





I liked last Wku battle vs Ghabry. Fanatics killed half BGK. :)

Also TELEDEATH, its very annoying hehe.

I uploaded the videos

Don't forget to watch wkurwiony vs. Ghabry at the same time using both "cameras" ;)

Yep i used that same army against WHF, funnily enough I altered the roster of my army purely because of that match with you and it was the new rooster I'd meant to fight against WHF with but i couldn't rerember which army was which and I picked the wrong one :), admittedly i think I would have still lost with the new rooster but it would have been a better match.

I wish i'd recorded that match against you (Jeronimo), it wasn't brilliant fun to play but the odds on winner must have switched what 4 / 5 times? & In the end I had 5 orcs left, i won that match by the skin of my teeth, it would have made a brilliant video.

The final was fought on the tutorial map which is fairly perfect for arty, enough trees to block troops but not enough to provide cover.  Also starting in the corner allowed whf to jam his troops into the corner making them impossible to get too.  I'll upload the video next week when I get somemore data allowence, although my mood went from excited, to whats the point before I clicked fight so its more a lesson how not too play ;)

I should have known really, in the semi finals the game i lost against whf was when he did the same to me with tons of empire xbow & archers.  I did think of fighting an empire battle with 2 cannon, 3 elven archers, 2 xbow, and 3 elven warriors + smattering of magic items, but I didn't want to descend into cheese.

Re Balance

Thanks again WKirony, the mod worked really well and produced many fun games, which I think everyone was happy with.
I’d say the mods fairly balanced good at the moment.  The only real problem i’d say was mages, the main reason they’re so powerful in the main game was due to hit & run tactics, esp with the vampire.  The current balance has discouraged that, but in turn shown mages to be surprisingly weak.  Everyone using a sup’d up mage seemed to be at a major disadvantage and was rapidly overwhelmed (in my experience) due to the large cost.  
Arty’s seem a bit powerful but I think that’s mainly down to mages being weak.  Maybe a 4/2 rule to stop games becoming ballistic matches. (upto 4 missile units, upto 2 of which being siege engines).


Empire:
Fine, although perhaps a small increase too xbow and elven archers.  The only real out of whack thing i came up against was elven warriors – perhaps reduce them to 12 units like archers?
The Treeman was used! –yay, although I still think he’s a bit too expensive.

Greenskins:
Generally fine, although I’ve heard people saying black orcs were too powerful.  Personally given they cost 930gp i think they’re about right given that they’re basically bigguns with out psy, and compared with flags & BGK’s...

Wargh magic still as piss poor as ever but you can’t do anything about that (although maybe make the war banner cheaper to make up for it?)

The only really problems are the cheaper stuff that are basically wastes of army slots.  Goblins and the bolt thrower, could do with being made cheaper (lets face it the bolt thrower is worth around 10gp    ), fanatics are a difficult thing too price as they’re as likely to plow though the enemies forces as you own.  I still think scorps & spids are are little expensive.

Undead
Probably the weakest side in my opinion, basic troops are fine.  I think BGK could be made a lil more expensive, horsemen cheaper.

Wraiths seem bugged, while they don’t lose troops they still seem to take psyc tests.  I broke a set with BGK who had no magic items.  They broke well after my knights had charged (ie during combat resolution).  Personally I think they’re a specialist unit and shouldn’t be used as you main troops (like you would say black orcs), but used as something to pick off enemy squads, maybe increase their movement speed for more manoeuvrability?

Wrights are awful, they have practically the same combat stats as basic orc’s, i’ve seen people use squads with the banner of defiance, great, except for that you just a bit short off a set of BGK, or 27+16archer skeles & a magic sword.  Instead of just making them cheaper how about giving them the trolls magic resist + the raise the dead spell?

Finally skele catapults.  I didn’t come across any of these (unsurprisingly), as an alternative how about removing the instant panic test on hit, reducing the crew to 3 (for slow ROF), then making them ethereal like wraiths?  They’ll be even more rubbish than before but will prevent people sitting on their ass vs undead and be tough to destroy.

My opinion about GOOD battles: there are 2 kinds.

Fun battle: is short and intense. Practically all the regiments are being used at the same moment, no time for boosting, you may forget to activate an Item. Small maps.

Interesting battle: is longer and odds on winner change every minute. Unexpected events occurs. Enough time to change plans (and consider enviroment). Big maps.

Darkmancer we had an Interesting battle there in Troll Land.
Instead of rushing (like u were going to do), you moved to the hill, making my 2 Pistoliers almost useless from surface. There were "unexpected events" like Miska Hawks working or missing and my Ptolos Shield failing (expected :)).

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 2 part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHx483pGvrc#normal)

Dark Omen January 2010 Tournament vs Ghabry 2 part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOFgozLL2kQ#normal)
missing fight with ghabry

and couple of things:

i dont think black orcs are bad balanced or overpowered in any way, sure they are often picked by GS army as they are natural unbreakable units, but check how much they killed after battles, not that impressive at all ;] they are usefull for the reason that player may utilize his tactic better and not for their sheer power of killing enemies

wraiths do take panic check when they fight, i noticed (might be wrong thou) that if they fight against massive regiment 27/27 it works more on their dissadvantage, so yeah 4/4 wraith will often run away, hell i even got situation where whfreak wraiths charged my wraiths straight ahead, and after couple of rounds my wraiths run away ;] so they are also not that overpowered as some might think

@darkmancer: i dont plan on changing original stats in anyway ;] so i guess only reg size and gc, and about wargh magic ;] well it may suck but they got this one spell that can change tide of battle in a split seconds ;]
and yes about mages, as we talked on irc after tourney

well next tourney with this ruleset is far far away ;] so i will have lots of time to tinker with it
hope everybody had great time as i did

- remove troll's land from the tourney map pool. this map is really imbalanced due of starting location of second player.
- decrease mages cost a little
- maybe add grail knights to humans? instead of 3 standard kngits, repalce it with grail ones (and boost stats a little)
- rebalance liche (add other spell) current spell is total rubbish, not usable at all
- need to boost some stats of UDs maybe. i found hard playing vs black orcs  with ud, cause main UD power (fear) doesnt worked. maybe change stats of skeletons a little (bootst up WS?)
- is it possible to add accuracy to UD catapuilt? if so, boost it. if not, decrease in price a little.
- is it possible to add damage for goblins shot machnie? if not, change price drastically.

Congratulations, warhammerfreak!

What a tournament, what a ruleset, what games!
I loved the videos!
It's awesome, guys.
Looks like the ruleset is amazing, and really balanced. The finals of the most of the games are bearely predicted up to the very last minute. What an intrigue.
Black Orcs rock! Finally greenskins have their fair elite unit. They are hell of a warriors now! Yeah, I'm so glad, being a goblin :)
It's such a pity I couldn't participate. But next month I'll do it I swear to Gork :)

all ok with  wkurwiony but..
4 wraiths  that when flee are destroyed?
6 coward and slow mummies.
so few skeletons , in archery infantery and cavalery who  die faster than goblins cause of the skeleton flag.

inmortal? units that does not even exist in warhammer world, goblins troll spiders scorpion.. why buy them having the inortals, ahh, dont forget the  boars boys, with the same price , what do you buy a  boar or a inmortal (retoric question)
very cheap lobbers and generaly warmachines.

hemlglart archers and pistoliers?? compared to elven archers everyone would prefer to buy   12 archers rather than 9 pistoliers or the human archers.

well. like almost all was imba,  it was in some way balanced i had battles that i dont believe they happened, olly lost against my like if he played this game for first time, i dunno what happened with olly 0/6, darkmancer, well that battles was so laggy that i thought i was going to lose but not.. i won the 2, and i won alavet orc armie with my human one :P then i lose 1 battle against him (ud vs ud).

and having 27/27 regiments with almost the same price that the cavalery 3/3 , you dont have to choice, it is almost obligation to buy the 27/27 regiment.

i have fun  because like i told i was so imba with all races that was something like bala...


yes very stronger , in the corner and with 2 lobbers, you are so fuc king brave player, do you play like that in the table top game?? cowardfreak , how you dare to play in that way in a imbalanced army, i even did not buy any mage with undead and human. and no artillery, cause they were cheap . i have a little respect to others players, well here you just drive ,me crazy reading your posts

sorry my bad word "*****"

i dont congraturate warhammer freak, but i admit that wkurwiony had the balls to try to make a balanced mod. i hope some one here had learned something, so can think insome balances  thinking inb the units capablity and usage. and stats. but no all have the abilitie to use w32 edit too see them :P well thats all

Wait a sec... Immortals have the same characteristics as Black Orcs in «Shadow of the Horned Rat», don't they?

@jim black orcs got same stats like bigguns with leadership at 8, and got armor 2 instead of 1, dont know why some ppl think they are overpowered ;] overpowered units are those that kill a lot, black orcs dont but they hold they ground pretty good

@lordbraprus said, well i must say he dont know game mechanics too much o_O 3/3 cavalry can rout 27/27 regiment and their cost is about half what 27/27 cost, second thing large regiments are easy target for ranged units, and tend to run away more than smaller units

about wraiths well they run of course like 5/5 and 6/6 and 7/7 etc its game mechanics nothing i can do about or you neither, or maybe you want to change stats and psychology of troops ? slow mummies ? blame games workshop... and they are far from coward unless you play good with them (i made mistake in my game and lost them)

UD army is all about their special regiments and supporting ones, dont think skeletons are meant to kill lots of troops but rather cover flanks

immortalz are legit regiment, they are black orcs and they are bodyguards of grimgor ironhide...
who would pick boar boyz over them ? player that would like to kill archers or other range unit regiments (hence not you)

and comparing 9/9 pistolers and 12/12 elf archers i would pick pistolers, but both of them got diffrent roles on battlefield

ok gonna stop here ;p

P.S. and lordbraprus maybe dont insult whfreak just because you lost oO guess your army wasnt so imba after all

Yerr i can understand not wanting to mess around with the stats, and I tried not to suggest stat changes it's just the undead are a bit of an odd side really, so i though you might go for changes that kept the weakness's but made the units worthwhile (i still think wrights with raise the dead spell would make a funky unit :) ).

@ lordbrapus, seriously grow up.  I didn't like WHF tactics anymore than you, but he played within the rules, and there's no need to insult him in anyway. 

But I've never seen them run in any games. They fight like skeletons. However bigguns run, and quite often.
Or is this because of the leadership 8?

Sorry, Ghabry, I've just read this comment of yours.
Well... There has been a huge missunderstanding I guess.
I just said (in totally different thread) that I would like to take part in the tourney. And asked about patching the game for the new ruleset.
I don't know how come you decided to add me. And absolutely don't understand where my mystical "confirmation" came from.
So it was a big mistake. I didn't want to spoil anything.

guess i was too hasty and i missunderstood you ;] my bad

ok, then this was wkurwionys fault :P (because he told me that you want to take part)

A small analysis. Some ideas for NB 1.8

ITEMS
I noticed Grudbringer Sword, Infernal, and Storm are priced 450gc when they're effects are not similar.
Mork Banners and Arcane priced 435gc (Mork's is a little better u know, try 500 for it and 450 for Arcane).
Horn of Urgok a bit more expensive like 3600gc (2950 is still cheap IMO :)).
Then Dragonhelm more cheaper (at 225 is expensive, try 125 like Potion of Strenght).
Make Spelleater more expensive than Ptolos (like 100% more), since is much cooler and effective than Ptolos.

ALLIANCE
Elf archers from 720 to 990gc.
Helmgart archers from 16 to 20 units (ranged units pass from 11 to 14, 2 front lines).
xbowen from 570 to 720 (dont forget they have ballistic 4, and shoot very fast)
Cavalry more cheaper (in proportion)
Flagellants from 840 to 930gc.
Mortar to 1080.

GREENIES
Immurtalz (very polemic regiment ;D) from 930 to 1080.
Orc Lobber to 1080 (seriously ruin battles).
12 Orc boar Boyz at 840.

NOTALIVE
Mummies from 1200 to 930 (since are only 6 units, retreat often)
Wights from 12 to 32 units (joking, make them cheaper from 1050 to 930, oh yes like 6 mummies)
UD catapult to 540 (50% of good catapults 8))
Zombies and Skeletons warrios/archers a bit more cheaper (not Ghouls).

"I imagine 10 goblins warriors at 60 gold.
I imagine 10 Zombies at 90 gold.
I imagine 10 dwarf warriors at 150 gold.
I imagine Wkurwiony taking this into account!"

                      Fragment of January Ballad

When things aren't priced at the right amount is it my fault to take them???? I know the army wasn't the most fun you could play with but what the heck, if I wanted to use it and it's allowed, what should be the obstruction. And dude I want all combat army too because it's more fun ( I already made a post some months ago but I never made it to a rulesset or something) so I know how it is to be shot to bits or magiced to death while not being able to do anything against it.

And I would like to repeat what darkmancer said. Grow up, seriously.


As for the mod itself that is more important then in what way or who won after all:

I helped testing it with Wkuwiony a lot, everybode knows this wasn't perfect but it is these things that helps us balance it:

I said that elven archer were too cheap and he made them more expensive. As it seems now they still aren't expensive enough. Also I said banner of defiance was to cheap, I think almost every army will use it( I know all mine did). I also thought the undead giant was soooo good, most of my armys have 2 and some even 3 (my tournament army had one cos wraits are expensive). I also think crossbowmen were underpriced, I saw them a lot and they always did what they got to do with me.

I think Osiris needs to cost more and maybe dragonhelm and the magic weapons less. BTW I love 3 unit cavaliries, they make wonderfull cheap drops, especially in an undead army cos most of your good stuff is very expensive. I don't really know what should happen with the liche as I almost never used it. Flags should also be more expensive as they were the core of most empire armys.
This is all on top of my head.

Wkurwiony, it was very nice of you to add me to the list)
But it was really weird that Ghabry even «confirmed» me after all.
Ok, let's move on)

Don't want to interupt the discussion about the ruleset, but... are there going to be more videos?
Looks like Jeronimo made videos too.

We were already in the confirmation step and wkurwiony said that you want to play ;).

---------------------

Ok now about the ruleset:
In my opinion it works in most cases.

There should be some limitation for archers/artillery because at the moment you can do some crazy blocking army builds (arrow and rock-rain) that you just can't break without an army that is prepared to break such tactic.

Undeads are quite useless at the moment. They have nothing special anymore. Black Grail with nearly no units, a useless necromancer/lich. Ok the Giant/Dread King is not bad. As long as the enemy has no fists of gork *g*. But the undead really need some improvments they are weak (except maybe spamming wraiths).

Da immortalz are really annoying. Like flagellants for greenskins. Imo this is a strange way to balance a race.
Oh and skabskrath is now nearly useless because every race has lots of unbrekable units now ^^

RE Rock & arrow storm (or cannon+mortar + arrow storm)

Normally this isn't so much a problem as you can march towards at angles and envelop/flank the enemy force.

The problem really occurs when they squash themselve into a edge or corner in which case your forced to engage head on and have to engage they're best * often unbreakable units head on while being riped to peices.

Solutions?
Reductions to ballistic skill,
price increases to bs 4 units + arty
editing of deployment zones away from edges & corners
rules against corner camping/digging in (unenforceable? wording?)
accept siege engine + shield of ptolos as a minimum requirement to all armies (perhapes not empire)
restrictions on numbers of siege engines + missile units (1 siege max? 0.o  )

Frankly all are a bit sucky, but a combination of the above are required if new balance is not going to devolve.

Flagellent keep being mensioned, increase gp? reduce units?  Or as an alternative massivily increase the amount of units (28-32) but make them cost a fortune (2.2 k+ so they'll be unusual and rare to fight against but damned scary :)

 

well that shows that you did not born to balance a pc game :D , in the testings didnt realise that hte units where cheap? mortar, lobbers cheap, the elven archers-imperial-archers-pistoliers things , was imba. ?? ... oko k i will may have to grow up, but you should learn to balance a game... tell me, in all this months of playing dark omen have you learned anything? (about the imbalances of the game)...

now i will grow up and wont say any bad word.. pfff

I like what WHF wrote about changes to do.

Its a New Balance Mod.

If Wku adds strange solutions of Darkmancer, it wont be attractive.

I like concept Arrow Storm. :D

It's a fine concept, it's just tedious in practice (win or lose).  In fact my first multiplayer game when i used wireplay (anyone rerember that?) i used a load of motars and elven archers.  My opponent logged off in a huff :)

When both players use the same tactic it propels DO to such retarded heights, that it makes minesweeper look shit your pants exciting.