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Author Topic: Monsterous Menagerie  (Read 27403 times)
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2010, 04:10:54 PM »

Great, let me know what you guys think.

Once again I must stress that the battles verge between easy (Luck with Fear) or Medium. At the time I tried a few tweaks here and there but it often led to enemies becoming overpowered ontop of the fact that two core Player regiments are only 3 Units / 6 Units and the enemy regiments are huge (Average 25 Units each with some as big as 30), so it may not be TOO challenging but I'll be working on it over the week to make it better.

While I'm here, some more details and changes:



The Player Army is technically Greenskin but not so much Orc dominated, more like the Monsters taking over with brute intimidation and wanting to dish out a good 'fumpin' to the enemy.

Said enemy consists of the Empire (First Level, Second Level, Brigands Attack) but then the real enemy appears in the form of a union between the Undead and the dire Night Elves, having conceded regiments to several Vampire lords.

Banshee:
Managed to get this unit working properly. Packs quite a magical wallop and isn't shy charging into enemy regiments. Sad part is, even though it's one single unit, none but magic weilders can kill them and it takes quite a while before even your leader can crush it with Grudgebringer so I suspect it'll be very nasty if they find a way to non-magic units and manage to engage them in combat - Sometimes it'll even rout the leader but overall it's more of a solid nieussance than a major threat.

Can't wait to test it when I get to edit later levels and place several of them in the map at once Smiley

Night Elves will be the core enemy and they are going to sport some very unique threats in later levels, such as the mounted archer cavalry, mobile archer artillery and some assistance from new undead. Should be fun but still work in progress.
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2010, 11:05:21 PM »

Going to spend more time with it tonight.

One change I've considered is altering the Spider Unit so that the Spider Handlers are changed to a cavalry based archer regiment, probably pistols - It somewhat makes sense because every game I've played makes it seem almost impossible to get any kind of respectable kills with the Spider (Hard to level up the regiment) seeing as it's just a regular spider with 5 Boar Boyz vs 15-32 man-enemy regiments which can easily kill it.

Failing that, I may swap the BigUns to the old version of the Spider Regiment (Spider + BigUns) and use the old slot for Cavalry Based Archers. Either way, going to tweak it in the name of fun and challenge.

Got some big ideas in stall for the regular Campaign which I want to test tonight.
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alavet
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« Reply #17 on: September 16, 2010, 06:12:31 AM »

man i didnt played your campaing yet, i will sooner or later eventually.

what i want to higlight, that
1) if you change unit type to archer he will never pursue
2) main soruce of experience, at least for me, it's a pursuing units with your fastest regiment. i.e. at campaing my cavalry always had max experience cause it's atatcked from the flanks/rear, caused fear, and pursued to the death.

(1) contradicts (2) so you will get even less experience in result imo.

also 6 archers, or pistoleters, doesnt have too much firepower anyway, i believe that signle goblin archer regiments with crowd of arrows could do job better in terms of killing units/gettign experience
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Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.
RopeDrink
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« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2010, 12:49:36 PM »

As said, I've been testing it.

Few things to note:

Spider+Extra persuing a 10-20-30 sized regiment of mostly fast moving elves - Isn't exactly going to kill much, especially as the Spider is the one with the top killing ability and not the rest of it's unit. I've had him persue regiments 100% off the battlefield and still they don't seem to kill many during it, especially not against same speed or faster regiments. I can't explain it but thats how it is. Yes I do charge from the flanks/rear as much as possible but once again, if it remains a 6-Man regiment charging a 25-30man enemy regiment, it'll get a handful of kills and either the enemy will rout, the spider will rout or the unit gets killed without support. I've played many levels one after the other and the Spider will always underperform when it comes to experience and total kills. If you try push it too hard, it will get killed easily too.

I have tweaked it make the regiment bigger - I've swapped the Archers for a smaller regiment of mounted Archers and given the Spider 7xUnits as support.

I've also been editing the BAT file for Rise of Dead file to spice the game up a bit - All credit to the RoD Mod creator.

I've been trying out the unique units (Marksman/Sniper, Banshee etc) and they seem to work quite well so far.

I'll keep working on it.
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #19 on: September 16, 2010, 04:54:57 PM »

Got a recording of general edited gameplay of the Trading Post level (minus recent tweaks).

The Outlaw Marksmen can be easily defeated, but because they are lone targets and because the level has many regiments, they sometimes embed themselves in hard to reach areas and pick off many of your troops, especially vicious on high ground - I really like this as it's funny to see one single person pick apart and scare off a regiment of monsters.

I'm curious to know if marking them as 'Evil Wizard' will cause them to attempt to retreat when harmed but I doubt it works like that as the CPU AI seems to adopt whatever AI the original units had. Example, if you were editing Trading Post level and tried to swap Goblin Infantry for Goblin Archers, the CPU still handles them as Infantry and don't use the added weapons - Shame.

Been at it for quite a while now, need a break - I'll likely make show a movie of it later today.
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Mikademus
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« Reply #20 on: September 16, 2010, 07:06:20 PM »

One thing I want to give you credit for is that you test things thoroughly and tweak for a good short- and long term gaming experience! Therefore I believe you will make a really worthwhile alternative campaign!
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #21 on: September 16, 2010, 11:25:07 PM »

Thanks for the compliment but I'm not entirely sure if that'll be true just yet...

What I should be doing is making an Army that is balanced vs the default campaign first - That way even if people just decide to use the PLY ALL ARM file then it's balanced.

What I've been doing though is thoroughly testing it versus enemy setups from other peoples campaigns (Rise of the Dead, REALDarkOmen etc).

I'm learning as I go, though. I've edited a WHEDIT File so that it contains all my Friendly and Enemy Regiments - This way I can tweak the Units then Copy/Paste as I go from Battle to Battle and saves some time. I've really edited a lot today but got a bit frustrated with some of the bugs and AI, but I think it's coming along nicely.

It's very very different now to what people can download in the first post, thats for sure - But for the better, I think. I'll likely work on it more either later or tomorrow and will show some recordings so people get a general idea of how it will work.
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2010, 06:29:10 AM »

Just a little update.

I posted in Malus "Rise of the Dead" thread asking if he'd mind if I use his Campaign as the basis for the enemies/spawn locations in my own Mod.

People may be pleased to know that even after playing levels several times, it's still capable of either kicking my ass or just about clawing out a victory - I'm just back after testing Battle 02 (Ambushing the Orcs but using Rise of the Dead version) and for the life of me I've never had such a tense and close battle, it literally boiled down to my own leader (alone, his guards where killed) and 8 BigUns versus 4 enemy regiments of Night Elves and pulled out the win by the skin of my teeth.

The difficulty of Rise of the Dead lies with the fact that many levels have hard to reach and annoying enemy artillery that can blow your troops to bits before they even get close to an enemy... My version is a lot lot different.

It's all about you starting off with a reliable but small army that is being relentlessly rushed by very fast and agile Night Elves and things can boil very quickly into a panic as you see so many regiments closing in on you from all sides of the field.

I've just about played Battle 01/02 enough to know where things spawn and whats best to do against them, and even then it's likely I'll take a truck load of heavy casualties.




Note on the Units:

Outlaw Marksmen/Sniper - These are turning out to be very very fun. It's amusing (but annoying) to see one single lone mounted human casually shooting down multiple numbers of your troops from a distance with nothing but a rifle on his own.

Banshee - These are proving to be very very very VERY nasty. If you can get a MagicSword weilder onto them it's usually ok, but until then they hurt... A lot... And even then they can easily outlast your leader and make people flee in melee.

Night Elf Infantry - Its not that they are cowards, it's that two of your units are terrifying. They flee... A Lot... But this can sometimes be a bad thing because this campaign is about trying to cope with swarms of them... And sometimes your Regiment loves to 'Cut Em Down' only to run into 3xWaiting regiments of more Night Elves Wink

So far the campaign is proving to be a solid challenge and a lot of fun - I've 2xRecordings I'll compress and upload to YouTube later or tomorrow so people can see this is action.
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Mikademus
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« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2010, 05:46:02 PM »

This sounds really neat! I'm looking forward to the recording!
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2010, 11:12:59 PM »

And here you go:

Warhammer DO - Monsterous Menagerie (RopeDrink Custom Campaign)DQ | by Aeva


Apologies for the delay - Been very busy with other Non-DO related projects and movies.

I also apologize for the music choice - I would have preferred the original in-game music or even the updated version of the DO Battle Theme but for some reason I recorded without Music so I wanted to fill the void. I couldn't find a suiting tune of the same length as the movie so I just picked whatever one I found that was 5mins.


If it bothers people feel free to mute it and play something you prefer Smiley

As for the movie, I'm not playing the battle blind but I still failed the campaign a few times, either because the Banshee is very tough or because the Snipers/Marksmen have a field day picking apart troops, especially the Leader but I feel that adds to the challenge.

Here you can see the attempted atmosphere - Your army isn't all that big, but you have to contend with a swarm.

The regiments are 10-15 in size starting out and they get bigger and more vicious as the campaign progresses so this is actually 'easy' so far.

Next time I'll show Battle 02 which is also complete.
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Jeronimo
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« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2010, 11:48:39 PM »

I have just saw the video. The music you choose is ok for me, a bit techno doesnt hurt the epic.

Very good aim with Grudgebrigner Sword. You should compete vs my brother (he also uses it preety well).
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2010, 12:40:02 AM »

Thanks - I'm not the best with it (You see me cause a friendly casualty at one point but I left the cursor where I aimed and for some reason the fireball went WAY left of the target) but it proves very handy in this campaign.

As said before, I've no interest in Competing in Dark Omen (Already play enough competative games) but I do love SinglePlayer hence I wanted to make my own DO Singleplayer experience Wink
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Mikademus
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« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2010, 08:57:53 PM »

Intense video! Great shame you missed that magic sword - a lone gobbo survived to carry it into the woods! Cheesy

This campaign looks like it will pose a challenge perhaps even for seasoned Dark Omeneers!
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RopeDrink
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« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2010, 09:10:06 PM »

I really do hope so but I also aim to ensure it's not overly difficult.

Problem I had with Rise of the Dead Mod was that it was stupidly hard and mostly because you're either heavily surrounded or the enemy has tonnes of artillery - I intend to make it more tactical than that if at all possible Smiley

Aye I didn't mind losing the Sword as I just entered and recorded so I could provide a video - I've had better wins and even worse losses on the exact same level Wink
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olly
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« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2010, 11:53:03 PM »

Great Vid and I haven't had time to test your latest download but will do this weekend.

Smiley

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and back in Nuln, the ageing Graf Berhardt smiled his secret smile of pride whenever he heard the latest tales of his eldest son's ever growing chain of glorious victories -(sothr manual)
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